[Suggestion] Stop sellers from spam promoting in threads.

[ArianaRisen]

Vote done

[lort1234]

@ when will the vote end?

[Luke]

The votes are basically 50:50 at the moment, which isn't enough for doing a rule change. However, we'll discuss the ideas posted here today and will give feedback for each of them.

[lort1234]

Originally Posted by Luke

The votes are basically 50:50 at the moment, which isn't enough for doing a rule change. However, we'll discuss the ideas posted here today and will give feedback for each of them.

Are the votes also 50:50 after clearing out biased opinions? Ofc no provider or seller wanna have a rule change since they will be less likely to get new customers in the way they are doing it right now.

Will be happy to hear what will be decided in the end of the day, i do hope to see some kind of change as 50% of the people including, see a need for a change somehow.

[zerogott]

Originally Posted by Luke

The votes are basically 50:50 at the moment, which isn't enough for doing a rule change. However, we'll discuss the ideas posted here today and will give feedback for each of them.

Its not near being 50:50.

If you say that 51,35:40,54:8,11 is 50:50 i dont see any point in the Vote in the first place.

37 People voted for it and over 51% are for banning self promotion in all threads.

Not sure why you wanna handle this vote as 50:50 now.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by lort1234

Are the votes also 50:50 after clearing out biased opinions? Ofc no provider or seller wanna have a rule change since they will be less likely to get new customers in the way they are doing it right now.

Will be happy to hear what will be decided in the end of the day, i do hope to see some kind of change as 50% of the people including, see a need for a change somehow.

My (personal) opinion is that there is no biased opinion, as we should weight the votes from sellers equal to buyers. As written earlier in my pov "looking for XYZ" threads are basically the same as "make me an offer", but I'm sure that there are other team members with a different opinion.

Originally Posted by zerogott

Its not near being 50:50.

If you say that 51,35:40,54:8,11 is 50:50 i dont see any point in the Vote in the first place.

37 People voted for it and over 51% are for banning self promotion in all threads.

Not sure why you wanna handle this vote as 50:50 now.

Please get your numbers straight, 19 votes are for a rule change, 18 against it, we don't do rule changes based on a 1 vote difference unless we see it as necessary. Also it should be obvious that these votes are only an indicator of the community sentiment, as 37 votes don't represent thousands of daily visitors.

[lort1234]

Originally Posted by Luke

My (personal) opinion is that there is no biased opinion, as we should weight the votes from sellers equal to buyers. As written earlier in my pov "looking for XYZ" threads are basically the same as "make me an offer", but I'm sure that there are other team members with a different opinion.

I get what you mean, i don't agree on it tho

I do hope to see some kind of rule change, as i think we need it and 50% of the forum that voted do too, i do value unbiased opinion more, since they hold a higher value to what the general forum member wants i think.

Will be waiting patiently to see what happens.

One more suggestion before the staff team decides on anything.

What about making an icon with the intention of the thread.

If someone is looking for an offer they could choose LFO (Looking for offer) and if they got a question is could be Q&A (Question & answer).

Sellers/provider would only be allowed to promote in LFO threads.

[zerogott]

Originally Posted by Luke

Please get your numbers straight, 19 votes are for a rule change, 18 against it, we don't do rule changes based on a 1 vote difference unless we see it as necessary. Also it should be obvious that these votes are only an indicator of the community sentiment, as 37 votes don't represent thousands of daily visitors.

Maybe you wanna explain me how to get my numbers straight since these are straight from the Voting that you added to the Thread.
There are 3 different options in that vote, not 2.

And if i look at the Vote the "Ban self promotion in all theards" has won so far (by 5+ votes/51+%).
If you want more people to take action in such a voting you maybe should consider sending out an survey to people that are active in the Trading sections and not "complain" that X votes are not the majority of the community.
But now saying "we dont make a change cause of 1 vote" is just dumb since that is what the majority so far voted for/wants.

[Luke]

Phew, you are giving me a hard time, it really should be obvious that voters of "Yes, except in threads where the OP is looking for an offer. (current state)" and "No." are fine with the current ruleset.

If you want more people to take action in such a voting you maybe should consider sending out an survey to people that are active in the Trading sections and not "complain" that X votes are not the majority of the community.

Not needed at the moment, as we haven't discussed this topic in our meetings yet.

It's fine if you see things differently, but ultimately you have to accept the outcome of our decision. So please let's not drive the discussion any further in this direction, thank you.

-------

edit: We'll give our feedback regarding the suggestions asap.

[yirici]

I voted for "Yes, in all threads" but we need more people voting or you should just ignore this pool and keep the current state

[lort1234]

Originally Posted by yirici

I voted for "Yes, in all threads" but we need more people voting or you should just ignore this pool and keep the current state

Even if there insn’t going to be more people voting, i think it need some kind of change, since over half of the community votes yes.

[yirici]

Originally Posted by lort1234

Even if there insn’t going to be more people voting, i think it need some kind of change, since over half of the community votes yes.

half community? I dont even see 50 votes

[lort1234]

Originally Posted by yirici

half community? I dont even see 50 votes

The community that choose to vote, which of the ones that votes more than 50% was for a change.

[Luke]

We've decided to increase the strictness vs self-promotion posts, instead adding an outright ban. For the sake of transparency here are two examples what is fine from our side and what not:

Good:

- User A ask for a [GAMENAME] cheat with controller support.
- User B adds some value to his post + link to his tbm thread, e.g. "hey there, currently there are not that much cheats with controller support out there, but you could try the one I'm selling [here, link]"

Bad:

- User A ask for a [GAMENAME] cheat with controller support.
- User B just spams his link..
- User C links his TBM offer which does not have controller support.
- User D posts his copy/paste ad which he already spammed to some other threads.
- User E talks about how good the ESP of his offer is. (off-topic)
- User F posts "check my bio/signature"

It should be noted that even if User D's offer has controller support it will still get deleted/punished as his post is most likely not on-topic.

So at the end of the day we try to hunt down those low-effort posts and handle them as spam as soon as we see advertising characteristics. This is our first measure and can be extended if it isn't fruitful.

---

Now to the proposals which do not relate to our new solution:

Make a new sub Forum like the black market, but where providers/sellers are able to showcase their products with video, guides, explanations and sale posts. This would allow any user to swiftly browse the sub Forum for something they are looking for. (Only positive posts should be in here, it should be a place where providers can post without dealing with users experiences.)

A sub-forum like that would basically the mirror the Trading forums, the idea to disallow negative posts is also something we do not want.

Make a sub Forum for threads that are for "Experiences/reviews" this should only for be users that have a confirmed trade on epvp with said provider/seller. (This should only be a place where the OP and provider/seller can talk about experience/review, possible how to improve or give feedback.

How about a sub-category added for each respective TBM section? Adding "Call of Duty - Requests" beneath "Call of Duty Hacks & Cheats" this then banning external advertisements outside of this? That way it's all controlled to some extent, with users being offered the ability to post their request threads there, then simply enforce the remainder which slip through the cracks via change in rules // ultimately just asking the moderators to move the thread if it's in the wrong section.

This would disconnect the feedback from the offer, in our opinion all feedback/experiences/reviews should be inside the offer thread, directly accessible for the visitor. It would also dramatically increase the forums we have to create.

Would the creation of an additional paid role, with a significantly higher price than Elite, make sense to introduce if it was the only role that allowed such promotional behavior?

This would put newcomers at too much of a disadvantage, regardless of this we also do not want any additional paid roles.

stop sellers not getting banned when claiming their cheat is undetected while its detected, but still selling it as ud

Detections happen and it's out of the scope of our responsibility. Selling a detected cheat as ud will result in negative feedback and negative ratings, so this is clearly a customer thing similar to amazon/ebay. elitepvpers itself is a community/marketplace, we don't curate things or do quality controls and we do not have any plans to do so.

[lort1234]

Originally Posted by Luke

We've decided to increase the strictness vs self-promotion posts, instead adding an outright ban. For the sake of transparency here are two examples what is fine from our side and what not:

Good:

- User A ask for a [GAMENAME] cheat with controller support.
- User B adds some value to his post + link to his tbm thread, e.g. "hey there, currently there are not that much cheats with controller support out there, but you could try the one I'm selling [here, link]"

Bad:

- User A ask for a [GAMENAME] cheat with controller support.
- User B just spams his link..
- User C links his TBM offer which does not have controller support.
- User D posts his copy/paste ad which he already spammed to some other threads.
- User E talks about how good the ESP of his offer is. (off-topic)
- User F posts "check my bio/signature"

It should be noted that even if User D's offer has controller support it will still get deleted/punished as his post is most likely not on-topic.

So at the end of the day we try to hunt down those low-effort posts and handle them as spam as soon as we see advertising characteristics. This is our first measure and can be extended if it isn't fruitful.

---

Now to the proposals which do not relate to our new solution:



A sub-forum like that would basically the mirror the Trading forums, the idea to disallow negative posts is also something we do not want.





This would disconnect the feedback from the offer, in our opinion all feedback/experiences/reviews should be inside the offer thread, directly accessible for the visitor. It would also dramatically increase the forums we have to create.



This would put newcomers at too much of a disadvantage, regardless of this we also do not want any additional paid roles.



Detections happen and it's out of the scope of our responsibility. Selling a detected cheat as ud will result in negative feedback and negative ratings, so this is clearly a customer thing similar to amazon/ebay. elitepvpers itself is a community/marketplace, we don't curate things or do quality controls and we do not have any plans to do so.

What about the situations where a user is asking for "The best cheat for [Gamename])

Wouldn't all providers be able to promote in these threads, since all of them would think their own product are the best?